no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

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BLAZERDLX
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no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by BLAZERDLX » Mon Jan 17, 2022 7:39 pm

Hi everyone,

I'm working on a 97 Probe V6 with a no start. Fuel pump does not run with key on, but works from the OBD1 connector.

Cranking is ok, but the fuel injectors are not triggered by the ECM.

I connected my VERUS scanner on the OBD1, the scanner remains waiting for an answer from the ECM. It's like the ECM is frozen, so no way to get any data from the ECM.

Very surprising by the way that on a 97 model, it's still an OBD1 (MAZDA adaptor) and not an OBDII under dash.

Finally I've bought a used ECM (of course with all part number matching).

Result: key on, fuel pump does not work. And the anti-thief light stays ON (was off with the OEM ECM).

Questions:
1- Do I need to reflash the ECM (the used one) with the proper VIN?
2- even if the anti-thief systems is ON, does the engine starts and then shut off, or simply no way the engine starts.
3- the Haynes manuel does not give the appropriate wiring diagrams for this specific PROBE (manual gearbox, 97 with OBD1). Does someone has them?

Well, any support will be appreciated.

Thanks
Blazerdlx

Kit
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Re: no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by Kit » Mon Jan 17, 2022 7:48 pm

Have you tried disconnect the CPS plug, near the cam cover, clear/spray with WD 40 , & put back together.
Normally does the trick ;)

Kit

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Re: no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by Kit » Mon Jan 17, 2022 7:52 pm

OBD II, was on the very last car, & in the US only :!:

Kit

BLAZERDLX
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Re: no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by BLAZERDLX » Mon Jan 17, 2022 8:00 pm

Thanks Kit,

No I did not check the connection on the CPS so far, but I did check the tachometer while cranking: no movement... (still not sure whether the signal is coming from the ECM or from the engine).

I will check this CPS plug ASAP.

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Re: no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by Sunfly » Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:01 pm

I've known your pain. Guarantee you its the CPS connector, sensor itself or wiring. In my case the wiring was cut by the crank pulley.

Before I found that out, I went through the same process as you!

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Re: no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by Kit » Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:07 pm

As you have Late car, it will have the ‘Temic’ system :!:
Where the Temic system is matched to the ECU.
So, by trying to put in another ECU, it won’t work.
Trust me , I’ve tried :o
You then need to sent it off to a guy in the Czech Republic, to get the to talk to each other

Kit

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Re: no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by BLAZERDLX » Tue Jan 18, 2022 10:20 pm

Thank you KIT,

so that explains why the anti-thief light stays ON with the used ECU, and also why the fuel pump still not runs with key ON (unless it's only because of the CPS plug).

Will check all that this week end and revert to you.

By the way, for those who are looking for wiring and connectors pin out, here is a good link (KING6FAB):

https://www.king6fab.com/how-to-technic ... 5-2-2-2-4/


Regards
BLAZERDLX

BLAZERDLX
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Re: no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by BLAZERDLX » Sun Jan 23, 2022 8:15 pm

Hello everyone,

First of all, a special thanks to KIT and SUNFLY: the Probe works again.

So the only thing I did was to disconnect the CPS plug, visual check, then plugged it back. I measured the resistance between the two wires at the ECU connector, 530 Ohms, no short to ground.

I checked under the dash and disconnected 2 white connectors from a module (see picture enclosed), I guess ABS or AIRBAG, then plugged them back.

Turned the key and the car started right away! :D

I guess this module under the dash has nothing to do with the start, should not.

I tried several times to start, no more issue.

A few comments here:

1- Key ON, engine OFF, the fuel pump does not run at all. It's the first time in 20 years in american cars I see that. Usually the pump runs with key on.
2- I connected the VERUS scanner on the OBD1, no way to get the DTC codes. When attempting to get them, engine running, the idle speed drops a lot, a message on the VERUS indicates to wait for getting the codes, but after several minutes, nothing.
3- I don't think so the CPS is failling, only the connection. But in case to replace it, looks like it's a pain, does someone knows how much it takes?
4- as for the TEMIC, I found out this link in UK that could be of some interest: https://www.remotekeys.co.uk/ford-probe ... emic-box-0

Again, thanks a lot for the support on this case!!!

BLAZERDLX


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Re: no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by Micron » Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:17 pm

The Item 3 - You will probably find that it is just the plug, it’s a very well known issue, rather than the CPS it’s self. As for changing it, it’s a bit of a faff, depending of the route the cable takes, the tensioner for the alternator has to come off or at least remove all the bolts, plus the dip stick to allow access to the cable. The CPS is held in with a 10mm bolt at the bottom of the engine.
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Re: no start but crank / no fuel pump. ECM failure or not?

Post by jrh » Mon Jan 24, 2022 8:52 am

Very well done for fixing the problem.
Question.
Was it the ECU or the CPS connection that cured the fault ?
I have a complete wiring loom for sale with all the sockets you would ever need. See under parts for sale.

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